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THE REWATCHABLES · August 3, 2021

Victory

A 1981 war / drama directed by John Huston, covered in the complete Rewatchables archive.

WarDrama1980sDirected by John Huston

ON THIS EPISODE

Overall episode#214Source sheet order
Movie year19811980s
Tomatometer70%Critics’ score
Metacritic57View score
Roger Ebert—No review recorded
DirectorJohn HustonWar / Drama

FROM THE CONVERSATION

What they said about the movie

The episode argues that Victory has one of the greatest movie premises ever: World War II POWs playing soccer against Nazis. The hosts praise the last 25-30 minutes as an elite sports-movie sequence, while noting that the first hour is slow and that several plot mechanics are absurd.
Based only on this episode’s transcriptTimes approximateSpeakers were clearly identifiedExplore the connections

WHY IT WORKS

What made it rewatchable

  1. 01The premise combines soccer and World War II escape drama in a way the hosts call nearly unbeatable. About 8 min
  2. 02The final match sequence is treated as a near-perfect sports-movie payoff. About 8 min
  3. 03Bill says the movie was a staple on HBO and easy to keep watching until the game arrived. About 8 min
  4. 04Bill and Chris love how the movie uses actual footballers like Pele and Ardiles to make the match feel real. About 8 min
  5. 05The Bill Conti score and widescreen presentation elevate the film’s rewatchability. About 32 min

WHAT DID NOT WORK

Their main criticisms

  1. moderateThe first hour is slow and the Paris detour drags. About 16 min
  2. majorThe Hatch escape subplot is unnecessary and implausible. About 48 min
  3. majorBreaking the Irish goalie’s arm to force the escape is absurd. About 48 min
  4. moderateStallone’s goalkeeper play is obviously fake and too shaky to be believable. About 40 min
  5. moderateThe film gives too little time to the rest of the prisoners and too much to the Hatch side quest. About 48 min

SCENES THEY KEPT COMING BACK TO

Standout moments

Favorite

Von Steiner proposes the match

The first Nazi-soccer negotiation establishes the central absurdity and the film’s energy.

About 24 min
Favorite

Pele injury and the first Allies goal

Pele gets clattered, the music swells, and the team counters for the first goal.

About 32 min
Favorite

Tunnel escape speech

Hatch is persuaded to stay and the team declares it can still win.

About 40 min
Favorite

Ardiles scoring run

Ardiles scores repeatedly as the team comes back from 4-0 down.

About 40 min
Favorite

Pele bicycle kick

Pele returns, finishes with a bicycle kick, and the “good Nazi” rises in admiration.

About 32 min
Favorite

Penalty save and mass escape

Stallone saves the penalty, the crowd rushes the field, and the prisoners flee in disguise.

About 40 min

WHERE THEY DISAGREED

The biggest debates

They partly agreed About 8 min

Did Stallone help or hurt the movie?

Bill Simmons

The movie may be better without him, though he is part of the star power.

Chris Ryan

He matters less than the footballers and the premise, but the film still benefits from his presence.

They partly agreed About 32 min

What is the best rewatchable scene?

Bill Simmons

The first counterattack and goal sequence is the best minute.

Chris Ryan

The Pele injury-to-comeback stretch is the best segment.

They left it as a friendly argument About 1:12

Could the movie be remade as a series?

Bill Simmons

Yes, but it would need to be radically reworked.

Chris Ryan

Yes, and it should probably be a different sport or different war.

They partly agreed About 1:20

Who won the movie?

Bill Simmons

Pele won because the movie became part of his legacy.

Chris Ryan

Pele won for the same reason, though Michael Caine is also a case.

Gus Ramsey

Michael Caine won because he proves he can work in almost any movie.

16 People discussedActors, directors, writers, and producers
very favorablePeleBill Simmons: Seen as the crucial credibility piece and the movie’s enduring soccer legacy. About 16 min favorableMichael CaineBill Simmons: Praised as very good in the film, though the movie cheats heavily around his athletic limitations. About 8 min mixedSylvester StalloneBill Simmons: His presence is important, but the hosts think he loses the movie and is not the main reason it works. About 8 min favorableJohn HustonBill Simmons: Respected as the old-school director who made the match look authentic and widescreen. About 8 min very favorableBill ContiChris Ryan: His score is singled out as possibly the greatest sports-movie music ever. About 32 min
favorableBobby MooreChris Ryan: Used as proof the film includes major football legitimacy. About 8 min
very favorableOzzy ArdilesChris Ryan: Highlighted as the flashy bridge between old-school and modern football. About 8 min
neutralWerner RothBill Simmons: Mentioned mainly as the player Bill recognized from the Cosmos and the penalty-kick sequence. About 16 min
neutralKazimierz DeynaChris Ryan: Mentioned as one of the international footballers in the cast. About 16 min
neutralPawel Van HimstChris Ryan: Included in the roster discussion as part of the football authenticity. About 16 min
neutralMike SummerbeeChris Ryan: Named as another real footballer in the cast. About 16 min
neutralGordon BanksBill Simmons: Referenced in the research segment as Stallone’s goaltending adviser. About 56 min
neutralRoger MooreBill Simmons: Mentioned as an early casting possibility for Colby. About 48 min neutralClint EastwoodBill Simmons: Mentioned as a possible Hatch, which Bill and Chris say would have changed the movie substantially. About 56 min
favorableJacqueline BissetBill Simmons: Proposed as a replacement for the French girlfriend to streamline the film’s Paris detour. About 56 min
neutralMaradonaChris Ryan: Mentioned as a hypothetical alternative to Pele, but not realistic for the period. About 16 min
10 Conversation takesSpeakers shown only where the transcript identifies them
Bill SimmonsLoved it

Victory as a sports movie

Calls it one of his all-time sports movies and defends the final match sequence as elite.

About 8 min
Chris RyanLoved it

Victory premise

Says the soccer-POW idea is so good it feels unassailable and almost impossible to improve upon.

About 8 min
Bill SimmonsLoved it

first Allies goal

Says the opening goal run is his favorite 40 seconds in sports movies.

About 8 min
Chris RyanLoved it

Pele getting hurt then the comeback

Likes the stretch that begins with Pele being injured and ends with the team rallying.

About 32 min
Bill SimmonsLoved it

Pele

Sees Pele as the indispensable star whose presence makes the movie credible.

About 16 min
Chris RyanLoved it

Bill Conti score

Ranks the music among the greatest sports-movie scores ever.

About 32 min
Bill SimmonsLoved it

widescreen/HD presentation

Says the film is a textbook case of widescreen improving a movie’s life on rewatch.

About 40 min
Chris RyanLiked it

Michael Caine

Thinks Caine is very good and that the production cleverly cheats around his physical limitations.

About 8 min
Bill SimmonsMixed

Sylvester Stallone

Admires Stallone’s run as a star but thinks he does not win this movie.

About 8 min
Chris RyanLoved it

beating Nazis

Treats beating Nazis as one of cinema’s great pleasures.

About 40 min
5 ThemesThe larger ideas in the discussion

Greatest premise as a movie engine

The hosts think the setup of POW camp plus soccer match is almost self-evidently brilliant.

About 8 min

Sports realism vs. movie cheating

They admire how the match feels authentic even while the story logic is silly.

About 8 min

Pele as cultural bridge

Pele gives the film credibility for American viewers and functions as the movie’s legacy anchor.

About 16 min

World War II as a durable movie setting

They connect the film to The Great Escape, The Dirty Dozen, and other POW-camp stories.

About 16 min

Beating Nazis as a cinematic pleasure

The movie’s Nazi antagonists are treated as ideal villains for a sports movie.

About 16 min
25 Facts and referencesProduction notes and other movies mentioned

Production note

The hosts say the film was originally titled Escape to Victory.

About 8 min

Production note

The movie is described as a 40th-anniversary rewatch for the episode.

About 8 min

Production note

A lot of the football cast were real athletes, and the hosts think that mattered enormously.

About 8 min

Production note

Pele was made Trinidadian in the film because of wartime timeline issues.

About 56 min

Production note

Stallone trained for soccer on weekends while filming Nighthawks and lost 40 pounds for the role.

About 56 min

Production note

The stadium used for the match scenes was in Budapest, not Paris.

About 56 min

Production note

The movie’s ending involved a real plan for the crowd to rush the field and let the prisoners escape in disguise.

About 40 min

Production note

The hosts say the movie did only modest box office in 1981.

About 16 min

Production note

Bill says the movie was on HBO for years and became a childhood staple.

About 16 min

Production note

The episode notes that John Huston was 74 when he directed the film.

About 24 min

The Great Escape

Used as the closest tonal and structural comparison for the POW-camp setup.

About 16 min

The Dirty Dozen

Cited as another classic WWII prisoner ensemble movie.

About 16 min

Rocky

Referenced both as Stallone context and as a sports-movie benchmark.

About 8 min

The Longest Yard

Mentioned as a sacred sports movie and as part of the 70s sports-film wave.

About 8 min

Blue Chips

Used as an example of a sports movie that cast real athletes heavily.

About 8 min

White Men Can't Jump

Mentioned as an example of a movie that did not prioritize actual athlete casting.

About 8 min

The Great Escape

Also invoked to explain why the film’s prison-camp plot feels durable and old-school.

About 16 min

Breaking Away

Used as an example of a film that made viewers want to take up the sport afterward.

About 1:12

Nighthawks

Referenced in the research section about Stallone’s training and weight loss.

About 56 min

The Right Stuff

Bill mentions Bill Conti reusing musical material from it.

About 56 min

Casablanca

Gus compares the French anthem sequence to the famous bar scene from Casablanca.

About 1:12

The Damned United

Mentioned as a strong modern soccer film.

About 24 min

Next Goal Wins

Named as an upcoming soccer movie that looks promising.

About 24 min

Wildcats

Used jokingly when discussing fictional sports-event attendance.

About 1:12

The Beekeeper

Used only in a sponsor read example about Jason Statham.

Opening minutes · medium confidence
10 Running jokes and short linesRecurring bits captured from the conversation

Bloody Count

Chris jokes that Michael Caine says ‘bloody’ like another actor says a far stronger word.

About 48 min

Good Nazi

The hosts keep returning to the idea of the affable Nazi officer who genuinely loves soccer.

About 16 min

Hatch as impossible goalkeeper

They repeatedly joke that Stallone cannot play goalie and that the movie hides it with tricks.

About 8 min

HBO rewatch memory

Bill recalls endless HBO airings and everyone joining in whenever it came on.

About 16 min

Sports-movie Hall of Fame talk

They revisit the larger idea of how to cast sports movies with actual athletes.

About 8 min

Bill Simmons

“the greatest premise of any movie”
About 8 min

Chris Ryan

“let's put these two things together”
About 8 min

Bill Simmons

“Please, Hatch, you must play”
About 40 min

Gus Ramsey

“There's zero chance the goalie lets his arm get broken.”
About 1:20

Bill Simmons

“we scored a goal”
About 40 min

MAKE IT A MOVIE NIGHT

Where to watch

UNITED STATES

Checking where Victory is available…

WHAT TO WATCH NEXT

Movies to watch before and after.

Three movies to watch before Victory, and three to watch next.

Finding six movies…Three to watch first and three to watch next.
Includes a Rewatchables episodePosters from TMDB.

ON THE MIC

2 voices on this episode

Bill Simmons headshotBill SimmonsThe Rewatchables
Chris Ryan headshotChris RyanThe Rewatchables

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